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How Apple Prompted Google to Create “Chromedroid”

News broke last week that Google was in the process of possibly merging Chrome and Android into what perhaps we should call “ChromeDroid”.

Although Google has not confirmed this (yet), Eric Schmidt’s recent comments at an event in Asia suggests this is likely. If you have read my columns in Tech.pinions recently, I have often suggested this was inevitable. Although Chromebooks have been successful in education, their lack of an apps ecosystem made it unlikely Chrome would be Google’s long term OS beyond its use in this vertical market.

I have also argued Apple’s iPad Pro, with its iOS operating system, would be targeted at business users and upper-end consumers and that Apple would make iOS the cornerstone of a broader push into business. As Tim Cook stated recently at the last launch event in San Francisco, “People can do 80% of what they need to do in iOS” — regardless of whether it is used for business or consumers’ needs. One of the more interesting facts about iOS is this is the OS Gen Z, Gen Y and younger Millennials cut their teeth on when it comes to their introduction to personal computing. It seems logical that, when this younger generation goes into the business world, they could or would want 2-in-1s or even laptops running iOS instead of being forced to use Windows or even the Mac OS X. Ironically, I was told recently that, to some of this younger generation, Mac OS X is now considered “their parent’s OS” in the same way the Mac generation of users referred to Windows in the past.

Using this logic, it is reasonable to ask the question of whether Android could also be the OS a portion of this younger generation wants to take with them into the business world? Although iOS dominates as an OS for most millennials in our country, Android actually outsells iPhones around the world. Many Gen Y and Gen Z, even in the US, start their computing journey on Android instead of iOS. Would they, like their iOS counterparts, prefer more powerful Android tools to take with them into the corporate world? If this happens, it seems this move could be highly influenced by Apple taking iOS mainstream. Depending how they craft these merged operating systems and their ability to scale to things like 2-in-1s and laptops, it will determine if Google will be competitive beyond smartphones in the future.

Google seemed hellbent to make Chrome OS their desktop and laptop OS and push this Web-based OS to be the one that transcends their tablet and smartphone Android platforms. But there is one problem with this. What makes iOS and Android so appealing is that each has over 1.5 million apps in their stores and Gen Z , Gen Y and millennials crave the versatility an app ecosystem gives them. Add to that the fact these operating systems are the ones they use day in and day out with a plethora of apps that meet pretty much every digital need they have and you can see why taking their mobile OS of choice to larger form factors in the business world makes sense.

With the iPad Pro (and a potential MacBook with iOS on it some day), iOS could be the enterprise OS of the millennials. Apple seems to understand this well. The new iPad Pro as a 2-in-1 makes it easy for this demographic to go from their current mobile first approach of using technology to making it possible for them to use a powerful new mobile form factor with the same OS in their jobs. Couple this with next generation iOS applications, such as the apps IBM is creating for iOS, why would they want or need to move to Windows if they can do the same tasks as powerfully and efficiently on iOS in a 2-in-1 form factor or lightweight clamshell?

It is clear to me Google realizes what Apple is doing with iOS and that Chrome would not cut it with this younger generation who want greater flexibility and versatility in the devices they use. While I doubt they’ll completely abandon Chrome, since it is getting serious traction in education due to its low cost and Web-based curriculum being designed for it, I am saying Google now sees that, for this younger generation, Android may need to be able to move out of its smartphone and tablet confines and into new designs that are more acceptable for use as a business tool when this younger generation moves into Corporate America. Merging Chrome and Android does this.

This is not a knee-jerk reaction to Apple’s iOS strategy, although I think Apple’s recent moves pushed them to do this sooner rather than later. The merger of Chrome and Android has been coming for some time. Google has stated they want Android apps to work within Chrome. It’s a good idea but, with Chrome being grounded in HTML, it does not provide the level of flexibility Android users want in various form factors. Merging the two and using Android as the core OS for cross-platform and cross-device implementations keeps them competitive with Apple and Microsoft.
Google has not publicly clarified the merger of Android and Chrome but I can’t see them doing otherwise if they want to stay relevant in a fast moving world where mobile is driving the future of technology.

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Tim Bajarin

Tim Bajarin is the President of Creative Strategies, Inc. He is recognized as one of the leading industry consultants, analysts and futurists covering the field of personal computers and consumer technology. Mr. Bajarin has been with Creative Strategies since 1981 and has served as a consultant to most of the leading hardware and software vendors in the industry including IBM, Apple, Xerox, Compaq, Dell, AT&T, Microsoft, Polaroid, Lotus, Epson, Toshiba and numerous others.

389 thoughts on “How Apple Prompted Google to Create “Chromedroid””

  1. “Google has stated they want Android apps to work within Chrome.”. Actually, it’s “Google has made it possible to run Android apps within Chrome”, a year ago, not only Chrome OS but even simple Chrome browser on Windows ( http://lifehacker.com/how-to-run-android-apps-inside-chrome-on-any-desktop-op-1637564101 , AMI’s $15 duOS is much better for that on Windows though).
    Android apps have to be validated to be officially supported in the Chrome store, or you can sideload apps, they all technically work since Google implemented the full Android environment, if the “desktop” use scenario is sane for them (landscape mode, fewer sensors, possibly no touch).

    I’m not sure if Apple in general and the iPad Pro in particular provided the thrust for that hypothetical move.
    1- Sergei Brin in 2009: “Chrome and Android are likely to converge ( http://www.cnet.com/news/brin-googles-oses-likely-to-converge/ ). Both OSes are based on Linux, then another layer (the Chrome browser for Chrome OS, the Android Runtime for Android). There’s not much difficulty involved in adding one or the other to anything, MS are porting Android to Windows, RIM ported it to BB 10; Chrome Browser runs on most OSes…
    2- MS is doing something very similar twice over, melding their Mobile and Desktop OSes *and* fusing an Android environment into Windows. Since Apple have been strenuously denying they’re interested in making iOS sane for desktop-ish use or melding iOS and MacOS, it’s probable MS’s move is having more of an impact on Google ?
    3- Users and OEMs have been using Android in desktop-ish scenarios for a while. I’m failing to find that story about the guy who ran his business off a Galaxy Note, but there are oodles of Android laptops, desktops, convertibles, TV boxes, desktops docks for phones w/HDMI, sound, USB, LAN… all a few years old. The main change recently has been that many of those devices are now dual-booting Windows thanks to MS’s loose licensing terms and Intel subsidizing the Mobile market. Google is probably aware of that, and twitchy about MS worming their way back in ?

    In the end, I’m not sure Apple’s very limited efforts have had a significant impact on that decision, given that the tech makes it easy, Brin announced it 6 yrs ago, MS have been much more deliberate in going in that direction recently, and users and OEMs have been doing it anyway for years.

    Reply

      1. Where is there emulation anywhere in what I’m describing ? Everything is native from the app code (it’s Java compiled at install time) to the Android Runtime (it’s Java + libraries)..

        Reply

        1. The emulation occurs at the machine abstraction level. An app designed to run on a phone expects to find phone hardware and drivers. You have a simplistic view of computer programming.

          Do you think “Android Runtime” ported to and running under Windows is native?

          Reply

          2. Mmmm… an app doesn’t see drivers but runtime APIs, these days. And Android runs on laptops, desktops, there’s no need for what you call “machine abstraction”. (whatever that is).

            Android runtime is native to x86, so are the apps. The runtime itself runs either as a Windows app (Bluestack’s solution I think), or in a VM (AMI DuOS). In the first case, the Runtime upstream calls have to be remapped to Windows calls instead of Linux (ends up pretty much equivalent performance-wise), in the other, a full Android-x86 including Linux is running, with the VM handling the low-level hardware interfaces. Not quite native, but very close, and VMs are a very mature tech. I think MS’s implementation is going with the first solution though.

          3. You reply with a mini lecture about Virtual Machines (VMs). But your lecture reveals that you do not grasp the fact that a VM is a software emulation of computer hardware, i.e.: a software layer of “machine/hardware abstraction.”

            Everything running on a virtual machine is running under emulation. An application running under a operating system emulated on virtual hardware, which in turn is running under a host OS (linux, Windows, whatever) accessing real hardware is NOT “very close” to being native. Software emulation of hardware will always be less efficient than an actual machine.

            If you were trying to appear knowledgeable, you failed miserably.

          4. “Everything running on a virtual machine is running under emulation”.

            No. That’s why it’s called a virtual machine, not an emulator.

            1- The apps run in native x86 code,
            2- the Android Runtime itself runs its native x86 version
            3- The hardware hooks to access peripherals do have to go through 1 extra layer, which costs less than 5% performance, and 0% for the overwhelming majority of the code wich is pure CPU with no I/O. ( http://serverfault.com/questions/135431/is-virtual-machine-slower-than-the-underlying-physical-machine , sorry no better source for a non-server use case).

            This is totally different from, say, iOS emulators on the Mac, which
            1- interpret app ARM code into x86,
            2- feed that to an iOS image that itself goes through the same ARM-to-x86 emulation
            3- go through a similar layer of peripheral abstraction.
            *That* is emulation, and has a large performance cost.

            You’re welcome.

          5. You seem to know everything, yet you don’t know when you’re wrong.

            There is more to machine/hardware abstraction than the CPU.

            But I bow to your infinite expertise. Too bad your world isn’t the same as the real one.

          6. “There is more to machine/hardware abstraction than the CPU.”

            Yes. That’s what point 3- is about.

            Once you run native and don’t have to emulate in 1- nor 2-, and just have to abstract 3-, you’re in a fairly good spot though, especially when what you’re doing is not I/O intensive, such as a mobile app.

  2. I see this more as an opportunity to cut out the carriers, and probably the OEMs, from the update process and provide the updates directly to the user.

    Reply

  3. Until Google can master and control and fix this kind of thing, they will never be let in the front door of Business. Risk factor is too great in my mind.

    The three malware families (named Shedun, Shuanet and ShiftyBug) are closely related but appear to be independently authored. Each relies on “publicly available exploits that perform the rooting function” and their “authors used the same pieces of code to build their versions of the auto-rooting adware,” the researchers noted, leveraging the ecosystem of powerful and easy to find tools for attacking Android devices.

    Reply

    1. Adware that roots the device to become persistent is a feature, not a bug. If Android security becomes less trivial to defeat, it will lose its competitive advantage.

      Reply

    2. Alll 3 are only available from 3rd-party appstores. Security rule #1: only install apps from the PlayStore. You’ve got to click past several security warnings when you choose to get out af that walled garden, and Entreprise policies can disable it.

      This is nowhere near as bad as the infected apps straight from Apple’s AppStore.

      Reply

      2. I do use Android , and it is a great OS, but security is pretty poor. Just look at the stagefright bugs(around 15-20 critical bugs) that allow virus to fully control your phone just by playing an mp3/mp4 file, even via the browser – which is a very common and unpreventable activity.

        And more than 95% of android phones haven’t solved this. And what about the next bug , given android’s shitty update situation (that’s only being solved, maybe, in the higher end for a few models) ?

        Reply

        1. Stagefright is indeed a very bad one, the other 3 are nothing comparable.

          On the other hand, the $1mil bounty for remotely exploiting and rooting the current iOS has just been claimed ( http://www.zdnet.com/article/hacker-claims-1-million-ios-9-exploit-bounty/ ). And apps with last month’s load of malware are still running on iOS devices ( http://www.pcworld.com/article/3000848/business-security/many-us-enterprises-still-running-xcodeghost-infected-apple-apps-fireeye-says.html )

          The Android update situation is bad, everyone concerned about it should get a Nexus. The iOS security situation is not better than Android’s though, tallying actual cases of exploits that have been distributed and installed on non-rooted/-jailbroken, official-store only devices. My issue is that every bit of malware on obscure pirate stores or for rooted Android devices (such as the ones that guy is talking about) gets more press than AppStore-distributed malware or zero-day on regular Apple devices.

          Reply

          1. And it’s pretty telling that people had to put up a $1 million bounty for an iOS exploit. Has such a generous offer ever been made available for Android?

          3. The $1 mil was not from Apple, but from a startup looking for publicity.

            Google has a regular program to pay hackers that reports vulnerabilites, and hosts a yearly hackathon. “Google paid white hat hackers more than $1.5 million last year to find bugs” http://uk.businessinsider.com/google-paid-white-hat-hackers-more-than-15-million-dollars-2015-1?r=US&IR=T

            Apple does neither and has to rely on the generosity / publicity-seeking of others. My take on it is they don’t value security enough to pay for others to test/challenge it. Or are afraid their underserved security aura will get dispelled.

      3. Obarthelemy, it is Android that had 32.8 million devices infected in 2012 alone by 65,557 different malware variants according to InQ Mobile and Cisco, F-Secure and Kaspersky all report that Android users are the targets of 97-99% of the mobile malware in the world.

        And it’s not just apps that are the problem, it is the operating system as well with Cambridge University reporting that 87.7% of Android devices are unpatched to critical vulnerabilities going back 4 years.

        The main problem is the time it takes for Android devices to get patched after each new critical vulnerability was publicised. Unlike Apple who can roll out patches nearly instantly to virtually the entire iOS platform for any vulnerability, Cambridge University’s research demonstrates that it can take 18 months for 50% of the Android platform to finally be patched against a critical vulnerability but bad luck to the other 50% who NEVER get patched against all of these vulnerabilities.

        That is one reason why Stagefright and its variants have caused such extreme panic across the Android ecosystem and why Android’s broken software update architecture is such a massive problem for the whole platform.

        Reply

        1. Again, those 32.8 million and 66k figures do not make a difference between safe devices and rooted or non-playstore devices. F-Secure and Kapersky have product to sell on Android, and have strong monetary reasons to spread FUD to move product, especially forgetting top point out the huge difference between safe non-rooted PlayStore only devices and unsafe rooted + 3r-party AppStore (especially the pirate ones).
          The relevant figure is how many non-rooted, PlayStore-only devices are safe. Google say malware incidence for those devices is 0.15% (1% for rooted and/or 3rd-party store users).

          iOS’ malware xcodeghost certainly infected a lot more users (“up to 500 millions” according to macrumors, which would dwarf anything that ever happened on Android), except Apple does not let third-party antivirus on iOS, making the figure hard to pin down, and removing antivirus companies incentive to study the situation. And Apple does not release figures.

          The Android update situation is not good indeed, get a Nexus or a ONE if you’re concerned, those are updated quickly.

          Reply

          1. Xcodeghost is nothing compared to the 1 Billion Android devices vulnerable to stagefright exploits or those 65,557 Android malware variants which do everything from install rootkits on infected Android devices, send premium SMS messages that cost users real money or turn Android devices into botnets.

            Xcodeghost is possibly widespread in Asian countries in particular, but the fact is it can do very little as it is very effectively sandboxed and almost all Apple devices are patched for all the latest vulnerabilities – unlike Android where 87.7% are vulnerable to 1 or more critical vulnerabilities going back 4 years. Xcodeghost is pretty harmless in comparison to your average malicious Android exploit.

            After all, it is Android devices that are documented to have lost hundreds of millions of dollars to hackers, not iOS. Just one of those 65,557 Android malware variants called Eurograbber siphoned 47 million dollars from the bank accounts of 30,000 hapless Android users in 2013. Then there is the Bmaster command and control botnet malware which has been siphoning between half to 3.5 million dollars off poor Android users per year.

            And 10% of those 32.8 million infected Android devices were in the USA – this isn’t just a east European or Asian App store issue.

            Now that is REAL malware. iOS has nothing like that.

            However, the worst problem by far is Android’s almost criminally delinquent update model. That is what really sets it apart from iOS when it takes 18 months for 50% of devices to get their critical vulnerabilities patched while the other 50% never see those patches according to Cambridge.

            That is why Stagefright is so bad – 1 Billion devices vulnerable to Stagefright and its variants which can compromise an Android device simply by receiving an MMS message or a chat message or browsing a web page. Stagefright and variants is a prime example where a user doesn’t have to do anything – the phone can be just sitting there and then wham it is infected and the user wouldn’t know. Even the proof of concept code released to the public by Zimperium could record audio and take pictures and access local storage and is 100% effective against every version of Android up to v4.4.

            This is why Android suffers from 97-99% of the world’s malware – there are so many vectors to take advantage of and most Android devices are never patched against the multitudes of known critical vulnerabilities.

            Nexus devices are irrelevant to the discussion as only a few million of those are sold each quarter so have zero impact on the platform as a whole.

          2. Again, you need to make a difference between official Android devices, and rooted or non-playstore ones. Whether when adding up malware or its effects. Failing to do that renders any argument useless, including your 97% figure, widely advertised by antivirus makers with stuff to sell on Android (but barred from selling antivirus on iOS). Like tallying viri on Windows pirate sites, which nobody ever did.

            Indeed, the update situation for Android is not good. The solution is simple: buy a Nexus or a ONE. People are chosing not to do that, which is not ideal, but probably means they value something else more than updates. That’s as relevant as anything: there’s a choice, consumers are making it. Discounting that is like saying iPhones are unsafe because people disable lockscreen security.

            Stagefright is very bad indeed, is does not require rooting nor non-playstore. I personally disabled MMS preloading on my phone, or you can disable MMS entirely if you’re not using them at all.

            Again, *all* Apple devices were vulnerable to xcodeghost. You say Android’s lack of updates on non-Nexus, non-ONE handsets is criminal, isn’t Apple’s refusal of third-party antimalware and oversight on all handsets at least as criminal ?

          3. “isn’t Apple’s refusal of third-party antimalware and oversight on all handsets at least as criminal ?”

            You need to think about the logic of your question. If third-parties had the ability to monitor other apps and have oversight on the handset, then that could only be the case if apps weren’t contained within their sandboxes. And if that were the case, you would definitely need those apps, because you would be constantly at risk of real issues like on Android.

            How is Apple criminal to refuse to create a less vulnerable environment in the first place, just to justify a need to make up for it in a way that can’t be easily implemented by all users of all devices?

            Instead, Apple removed the affected apps from the store and devices; and in the future, any apps created using a non-signed copy of X-Code will be detected.

            Yes, that is less criminal than a situation in which half of all iPhones (or, say, all 5s, 5c, 5, and 4s) did not get an instant, one-click security update just as easily as 6’s. Only, it is just as easy for any iPhone to get a security update as any other; and it’s simple for any iPhone user to activate an update. That is simply not the case on Android.

          5. Oh man! You sure won that round! Such amazing logical jujitsu:

            other person: ‘tens of millions of Android phones have critical security flaws that allow drive-by device rooting leaving the device permanently vulnerable. There is no patch available to them.’

            you: ‘but Apple ‘s worse.’

            someone: ‘do have any concept of scale or comprehension of the vast differences in the effects of things?’

            you: ‘here’s an old cherry-picked article that makes Apple’s problems look bad. Android’s better.’

            There needs to be a new word created to describe the delusional, irrational, psychosis you suffer from. “Stockholm Syndrome” isn’t sufficient.

          7. Nexus devices are irrelevant to the discussion because they are not universally available and do not make up the vast majority of Android devices sold. We are comparing the security of platforms here not a tiny sliver of Android.

            The number of iOS users who leave the lock-screen enabled is not a tiny fraction of iOS devices unlike the tiny percentage of Android devices that are Nexus.

            That is why Cambridge’s finding that 87.7% of Android devices are wide open to critical vulnerabilities going back 4 years is so devastating. Oh, and disabling MMS preloading alone isn’t going to save users because other Stagefright variants mean browsing a web page or using any of thousands of other apps that use the Stagefright media framework are also vulnerable to silent automatic compromise.

            As Kizedek says, allowing third party anti-malware vendors and other apps global access to devices beyond their sandbox is itself tantamount to a massive compromise of the security of that platform. Far better for the OS vendor to perform that function than any old app developer such radical access to the OS and other apps. AV vendors hold Android hostage only because Google has abdicated its responsibilities in this area.

            And no, “all” Apple devices are not vulnerable to xcodeghost as it only affected a tiny percentage of the 1.5 million apps in the App Store which have now been expunged. Even if they were though, because of Apple’s strict sandboxing and the huge percentage of iOS devices fully patched for all the critical vulnerabilities, xcodeghost can do very little damage in comparison to what Stagefright and those 65,557 other malware variants can wreak on the 87.7% of the Android platform that is wide open to known critical vulnerabilities going back years.

          8. Nexus and ONE devices are relevant to the discussion because though people are choosing not to buy them, but they do have a choice. Same as they chose to buy cars w/o antilock brakes, airbags… that doesn’t make all chevy cars bad. The Android platform does offer a well-updated option, but also offers customers choice to choose other features (price, specs, form factor…). It would be better if all devices were updated, but consumers seem to overwhelmingly prefer Android’s value proposition to Apple’s anyway.

            87% of handsets being vulnerable to malware is bad, especially when the vulnerability is old and fixed in newer versions. Yet Apple’s devices have more vulnerabilities. Relying entirely on Apple to detect and fix issues, when they’re not even willing to disclose or help fix them ( http://www.dailytech.com/Apple+Orders+Technicians+to+Feign+Ignorance+About+Mac+Malware/article21693.htm), and when iOS has more than its share of issues, doesn’t seem like a valid solution. iOS seems to be having the security alert of the month too, even moreso than Android.

            xcodeghost affected a tiny percentage of very popular apps. 500 million installs according to MacRumors. Maybe it was only from a few thousand apps out of millions, but it did reach a huge percentage of the iOS userbase. Also, Apple’s sandboxing has been hacked several time, including on iOS 9, moreso on older versions (still running on 33% of all iPhones https://developer.apple.com/support/app-store/ , it seems the update problem is not circumscribed to Android)

          9. Sorry obarthelemy you mortgage your right to say Nexus matters when you compare ALL of Android to iOS in the next breathe on every other issue. You can’t have your cake and eat it too. We are comparing platforms not a tiny handful of Nexus devices.

            Oh and note that there are 800 million active iOS users out there, almost 57% of Google’s 1.4 Billion Android devices according to FaceBook and Google themselves. As such, even though the ASP on iPhones is 687 dollars compared to the bottom of the barrel 254 dollar ASP of Android devices, it looks like those who can afford it definitely prefer Apple’s value proposition.

            The bulk of Android purchasers can’t afford or access the Nexus alternative.

            Whether Apple reports more vulnerabilities than Android is irrelevant when the vast majority get patched promptly unlike Android. Unpatched holes targeted by malicious exploits is what counts.

          10. “Unpatched holes targeted by malicious exploits is what counts.”. Indeed. Anything coming close to xcodeghost on the Android side ?

          11. You are so dishonest.

            Xcodeghost is malware. It doesn’t exploit “Unpatched holes.” There is no flaw in iOS that allows xcodeghost to exist, and when you delete the infected apps, the problem is solved. (and don’t even TRY to claim the iOS app store is the flaw because countless millions of malware apps have been downloaded from Google Play – and it continues to be a problem).

            Stop quoting Macrumors’ 500 million number like its some kind of goddamn fact. That was a “potential number,” not an actual number. If I play the same trick, then 1.6 billion Android devices are still affected by Stagefright. That number is bigger than 500 million, by the way.

            Androids security problems are FAR worse, because they are inherent to the OS. The entire world knows this, but you fight on, oh Black Knight. I’m not even going to bother posting the most recent Android security flaws that have been exploited in the wild, because by the time I do, three more will have been reported. Let’s just say that the relatively benign problems introduced by xcodeghost can’t hold a candle to the crapstorm in Androidland.

            Android is the new Windows XP.

          12. I’ll leave the floor to MacRumors:
            “that the malware has the ability to receive commands from the server
            which could result in forcing your iOS device to open web pages or
            create fake prompts to trick you into giving up your Apple ID and
            password. It could even possibly access data in your clipboard to steal
            passwords you have stored in a management app,”

            That’s if you don’t combine it with the several separate sandbox-busting hacks that exist oniOS. Luckily, it didn’t happen. This time.

            As for the potential vs actual 500mil, I’d be happy to quote another number if we had any, but Apple is sweeping all info under the carpet.

          13. Yeah, everything is under the carpet. Your troll qualities are really shinning through. http://www.apple.com/cn/xcodeghost/#english

            Everything that xcodeghost MIGHT have done, Android malware has already been doing for years. And far more.

            Xcodeghost did not and could not root your device. Xcodeghost was not and is not persistent after app removal.

            Shedun, Shuanet, and ShiftyBug work on all versions of Android. They completely root your device. They can direct you to websites which exploit other Android “hacks,” too. They persist after removal attempts.

            And remember, StageFright can be exploited by merely copying a media file. Any rouge app could do that without needing fake prompts.

            Where is the malware for iOS that is worse than these?

            You’re not going to win this one, Black Knight. It is more than a flesh wound.

          14. Shedun, Shuanet, and ShiftyBug were never distributed on the PlayStore.

            xcodeghost was.

            I’m not saying the Android security+update situation is good. I’m saying Apple’s is just as bad: more updates, but more vulnerabilities and more actual exploits. several hundred millions tops anything that ever happened on Android. Just be thankful it was a rather mild malware. This time.

          15. And when you say that Apple is “just as bad” and that there have been more “actual exploits,” you make yourself look like a fool beyond words.

            Again: xcodeghost is malware. It did not exploit anything inherently flawed in iOS. There was no need for a patch, and several hundred million is a bullshit number.

            To date, no malware from the Apple App Store has ever exploited a security hole in iOS.

            Malware on the PlayStore is still a problem. Besides, you have always claimed that the ability to side-load software from anywhere was THE huge advantage of Android. What’s with the ‘only download from the walled garden of the choice limiting PlayStore’ line? Could you possibly be more hypocritical?

            Seek help, Black Knight.

          16. “Again: xcodeghost is malware. It did not exploit anything inherently flawed in iOS.”. Mmmm… if there’s nothing flawed in iOS, how can there be malware to start with ?

            “To date, no malware from the Apple App Store has ever exploited a security hole in iOS.”. Indeed. Consider yourself lucky, because there are both malware in the Apple store and security holes in iOS, they just haven’t been combined yet.

            “Malware on the PlayStore is still a problem.” Indeed: 0.15% of playstore-only phones do have some kind of malware, according to Google’s official security survey. I’d put Apple’s figures opposite that, but they don’t release any.

            The ability to sideload software is extremely important as a matter of principle, and in the long term: a customer should be able to install whatever he wants on his computer, now and in the future. As for doing it right now, it’s recommended only for experts looking to install advanced tools/settings, or if you stick to serious 3rd-party stores (Amazon’s). Loading pirated apps from dubious forums in particular is as unsafe as using Cydia on Apple’s side ( http://researchcenter.paloaltonetworks.com/2015/08/keyraider-ios-malware-steals-over-225000-apple-accounts-to-create-free-app-utopia/ , 225,000 Apple accounts hacked, not bad)

          17. You should get an Android device because there is more choice. You should get an Android device because you can potentially side load, sometime. When it’s not too risky. …etc.

            Never mind that once you do choose and purchase the actual Android device you actually use, it doesn’t live up to all the promises aggregated for the entire Android universe; never mind that few, average, users can easily get an OS update. Never mind that you should know what is good for you and leave side loading to “experts looking to install advanced tools/settings”; never mind that there is little recourse to actual exploits affecting actual users, however personally vigilant a few totally informed users like Obart make themselves …etc.

            And how is all that not delusional or deceptive?

          18. Apparently, the Black Night thinks Android users should be locked-in to one or two phone models and only software from one official store.

            Apparently, this lack of choice is the secure way to be on Android.

            I say ‘apparently,’ because the Black Knight argues out of both sides of his mouth. Often within the same paragraph. Choice is good, choice is bad, lock-in is evil, lock-in is good. He can’t even keep up with his own spin.

          19. Okay, I understand and respect that you value security as paramount. You’re probably wise to do so. There are other ways to deal with it.

            I don’t choose the city I would live in based on the Police force, and if I did I would balance their authoritarianism versus their tolerance.

            In the end, we should be blaming the bad guys.

          20. “In the end, we should be blaming the bad guys”

            No, we should be blaming Google who left the door open for anyone to walk in and take whatever they wanted. 1.2 Billion Android devices have their front doors swinging in the breeze to critical vulnerabilities going back 4 years thanks to Android’s completely broken update architecture.

          21. The flaw is a severe one, is the update process. But the blame isn’t Goggle’s alone. It involves Google, the OEM, and the carrier. Hang them all! Pitchforks and torches will be handed out at the entrance.

            Like I said earlier, perhaps this merged OS will wrest control from the carriers and OEMs. Still, it’s acceptable risk, for me anyway, over a gated community.

          22. “Mmmm… if there’s nothing flawed in iOS, how can there be malware to start with ?”

            Stupid much?

          23. Yep, 87.7% of 1.4 Billion Android devices targeted by 65,557 different malware variants, the majority of which do far more damage than xcodeghost. It will also be interesting to see the financial impact of Stagefright once malicious exploits of that massive vulnerability on the vast masses of un-patched Android devices come to light.

          24. Counting malware for rooted non-playstore devices again.
            And counting potentialities vs stuff that actually happened.

          25. Assuming all those 32.8 million infected Android devices in one year were rooted non-playstore devices is only your un-founded supposition, particularly since 10% of these (over 3 million) were located in the USA.

            You have yet to present evidence for a financial hit on iOS approaching just one of those 65,557 Android malware exploits – Eurograbber with it’s 42m dollar impact on the bank accounts of 30,000 hapless Android users.

            With 87.7% of Android devices suffering unpatched critical vulnerabilities, malware from App Stores is just one of many potential vectors of infection for Android devices.

          26. Well, you’re assuming they weren’t. Please do provide the proof you’re right and not making an “un-founded supposition” yourself.

            There were 80 millions installed Android devices in the US at the end of 2013 ( http://9to5mac.com/2014/01/10/nope-android-doesnt-represent-80-percent-of-the-smartphone-market/ ), estimates of how many people root their phones vary widely, Tencent conducted the largest study and found 27%, let’s say 10% to be conservative… that’s still well above 3 millions.

            At some point 100% of iOS devices have suffered unpatched critical vulnerabilities, so the 87% mantra is a bit funny actually.

          27. I’m not the one who is brushing off all of those 32.8 million infected devices in one year by claiming they were all rooted or non-Playstore.

            With vulnerabilities like Stagefright not even needing to be exploited through an app on an Appstore, claiming that staying with the PlayStore keeps you safe is patently incorrect.

            In terms of vulnerabilities, the difference is that Apple devices promptly get patched while on average Cambridge University reports that 87.7% of Android devices remain unpatched to these critical vulnerabilities. That is 1.2 Billion vulnerable Android devices.

            So where’s your evidence of financial impact on iOS users to rival even that single 42m dollar Eurograbber exploit (let alone the 65,556 other strains plaguing Android).

            That is the dreadful reality and why Android is called a toxic malware hellstew.

          28. Don’t you love how the Black Knight can just dismiss a study by Cambridge University? But he grabs hold of a speculative article from MacRumors like its the fully-vetted, revealed Truth from on high, complete with angelic choirs and cherubim.

    3. Android is already pretty big in the enterprise. If you are an enterprise customer and are working directly with an OEM, you can manage security. Also, recognize how the official ChromeOS from Google is only available on certain systems and is automatically updated by Google.

      Reply

      1. Android is actually pretty small in the Enterprise.

        Citrix’s Enterprise Mobility Cloud Report shows that iOS has GROWN from 58% of all smartphone and tablet enterprise mobility management deployments (62% in the USA) in 2012 to 64% worldwide in the first half of 2015. Android has plunged from 35% of all deployments in 2012 to 26% in 2015.

        Intermedia’s Mobile Trends Report shows that Apple’s share of Small to Medium Business has increased from 65% in 2011 to 68% in 2014. Android languishes on 26%.

        Egnyte reported in 2013 that Apple’s iOS mobile business market share increased from 69% to 78% while Android declined from 30% the previous year to only 22%.

        Reply

        1. I didn’t mean to imply Android was bigger than iOS. Simply, enterprises are using Android, and as i said, when they work directly with OEMs, security issues can be handled quite well. Even if they are not working directly with OEMs, there are number of tools out there to help manage security issues and concerns.

          Reply

          1. Unfortunately it hasn’t worked for the US Military who now uses Android phones for classified communications. Their thousands of phones are all still wide-open and un-patched for the critical Stagefright vulnerabilities. So much for Android helping Enterprises manage their security issues and concerns… 🙂

          2. Nice try. The US military spent 5 years and millions of dollars trying to develop a secure phone. The phone turned out to be hard to use and incompatible with 4G networks. So they scraped the program and worked with the carriers to get off the shelf Android phones. As far as I know, they did not work directly with OEMs so they were stuck relying on the carriers for security patches, which is never a good idea. This is more a failure of how the US military went about acquiring and deploying Android devices than a failure of Android itself.

          3. Unfortunately Mr Phish, you’ve merely highlighted how beholden Android customers and OEMs are to the Carriers. If the US Military can’t disintermediate the Carriers from disrupting critical software updates, what hope does your average corporate customer have?

            Only Apple it seems (nod to Steve Jobs) has had the chutzpah and sheer force of will to keep the Carrier’s crapware and painted-on logos off their phones and completely cut them out of the critical process of updating devices.

            Google’s “Open” policy of abdicating responsibility for updating their platform is now coming home to roost – with a vengeance.

  4. I agree that this change in strategy, “folding Chrome OS into Android” as the original WSJ article put it, is not a knee jerk reaction to Apple. This is certainly something that has been discussed for a long time within Google. Hence when trying to understand what this really means, I consider the iPad Pro to be a distraction rather than an important trigger. We should try to understand the underlying shift in the computing landscape that compelled Google to abandon it’s original browser-centric strategy.
    To do this, it is important to revisit what Chrome OS is. Chrome OS was announced in July 2009, just 1 year after Apple introduced the iPhone App Store, and 1 year before the introduction of the iPad. The idea of native mobile apps becoming a dominant force in computing was still unimaginable, and so was the idea that mobile operating systems would challenge PCs. Netbook sales were up a staggering 264% YoY. Web Apps were a huge success and gaining momentum.
    Chrome OS represented the future of computing as an extrapolation from 2009. It was the future of desktop PC computing in a Web App world. Chrome OS is the ultimate Web App computing platform.
    Times have changed. The Internet is no longer about the web and the browser, and is increasingly about native apps that use the Internet to retrieve cloud based information in either JSON or HTML (in the case of WebView apps) formats. The momentum is shifting from Web Apps to Native Apps. The future of computing is no longer the web. In this context, Chrome OS looks really old fashioned. The future didn’t turn out to be an extrapolation from 2009.
    If you look at the situation this way, Google’s strategy change is not only about the iPad Pro or security or touch interface or business or clamshell or 2-in-1 or keyboards or emulation. It is about the web and the reluctant realisation that the browser is not the future, no matter how hard Chrome engineers work at adding features to HTML, CSS and JS. The web will live on in WebViews, but it will never be a single platform that developers can build everything on.
    I personally think that this is a very good thing. Web browsers have significant security issues often because a single process handles multiple websites. Having a totally different process for each site in the way that native apps do it makes much more sense. Rushing features that allow them to behave like native apps will only make matters worse. I think it’s also good for Google because clinging to an outdated model can only do harm.
    It’s not about the iPad Pro nor anything Apple has done recently. It’s about the shift to apps.

    Reply

    1. “Chrome OS represented the future of computing as an extrapolation from 2009.”

      Yes, exactly. It lacked vision, it extrapolated the present instead of envisioning the future. The future of computing was never the web, that was an idea promoted by people who (wrongly) saw the future of computing as the web.

      Reply

      1. I assume that when you say ‘the web’, you mean the browser. As you know the Web is a large collection of services, not just the browser, which relies on these services. By the same token, ‘Apps’ rely on them too. Most, certainly not all, Apps are glorified Web pages.

        The cloud is rebranded client/server which itself is rebranded mainframe. The push towards the cloud IS a push towards making the cloud the main computing platform.

        By numbers, mobile is by far the largest computing platform, yet it trails the desktop in ‘on device’ computing capability by a decade. If mobile is the future, the cloud, meaning the Web, makes that possible. IMO the trade off is a shift away from ‘Personal’, since it’s essentially mainframe computing.

        Reply

        1. Not sure what apps you use on mobile, but none of mine are glorified web pages. It is obvious that computing is moving to the network, we’re going to see an Apple Network of Things as we move forward, shared processing and data, and something similar on other platforms. Your note about the on device computing capability of mobile trailing desktop is exactly why people extrapolate the present instead of seeing the future.

          Reply

          1. If an App performs functions that a webpage cannot do, or cannot do well, it deserves to exist. Otherwise, it is a glorified web page. Strictly IMO all publishers, media, and banking companies Apps are glorified web pages.

            Then there’s the issue of redundancy…One web browser knocks out thousands of Apps. It’s like keeping a different phone, as opposed a phone number, for each person you want to call.

            Still, if an App depends on web services, it still relies on the Web, not just the browser. The Web is bigger than the browser.

            We will see an Apple Network of Things. We will see other ecosystem’s versions as well. So….?

            Mobile trails the desktop in capability, and will for the foreseeable future. If you need a PC, then you will have a PC. Not everyone needs a PC, and mobile suffices. Better yet, everyone needs mobile, but IT’S the lowest common denominator as far as compute goes. This too is true for the foreseeable future.

            I advocate marching towards a progressive future as opposed to a recessive one. On performance, mobile is recessive for compute bound jobs.

          2. “I assume that when you say ‘the web’, you mean the browser. As you know the Web is a large collection of services, not just the browser, which relies on these services.”

            “Still, if an App depends on web services, it still relies on the Web, not just the browser. The Web is bigger than the browser.”

            Not so. Normally, when people refer to “the Web”, that is exactly what they mean — the “browser”.

            You are confused between “the Web” and “the Internet”. It’s the Internet that is bigger than the Web, not the Web that is bigger than the browser. “Web” just comes from “www.” Dedicated Apps can access online services that don’t have a public face accessible by a webpage. If a service also happens to offer access via a webpage or browser-based app, then that is just another way to access it.

            “One web browser knocks out thousands of Apps. It’s like keeping a different phone, as opposed a phone number, for each person you want to call.”

            Not really. An app is more like a bookmark in a browser, than a separate phone. Your mobile OS should find apps as quickly as you can find a bookmark in a browser.

          3. “Not so. Normally, when people refer to “the Web”, that is exactly what they mean — the “browser”.”

            People are wrong. 🙂

            By mere virtue of Apps using the Web, as in infrastructure, disqualifies that outlook. Unless, of course, you consider such Apps as very specific purpose site browsers. Anything that uses http (and allied transport protocols) is part of the Web, which is but a subset of the Internet itself.

            “Your mobile OS should find apps as quickly as you can find a bookmark in a browser.”

            If you have few Apps, that works. If everything becomes App centered, you’re hunting for your Apps. In that case, what’s quicker-hunting for your Apps or just loading your browser and entering a bookmark, history item, or address?

          4. “what’s quicker-hunting for your Apps or just loading your browser and entering a bookmark, history item, or address?”

            There should be no difference. You start to type a word or search term, and you get the best result, period.

            In my iOS search bar, I just typed “Freshbooks”. The results are labeled “Top Hits”, so that reflects how I use my device. I got the app at the top of results, then a couple of emails in which I had referenced it, and then their website.

          5. “So, the fact that apps may use web protocols, does not mean the web provides the infrastructure that the apps rely on.”
            That’s exactly what it means. There are machines out there that get their operational instructions from the web, without involving a browser. Many databases as well. Heck Office suites access the web using the underlying services, without using a browser. Updating tables in a spreadsheet, for instance.

          6. So, because a database can be accessed via the web, means it’s infrastructure is provided by the web? Doors and windows don’t support buildings.

          7. I don’t think that diminishing the browser to the level of doors and windows is quite appropriate, though it does let you into the building which is the Web, located on the Internet Campus….
            🙂

          8. If that’s not appropriate, it’s certainly not appropriate to say that the scope, nature and operation of something is defined or determined by what you can see or reach of it through that door or window.

            I’m not diminishing the browser so much as you are diminishing or defining the whole building in terms of what you can see of one part through one set of windows or doors. (The internet being the building and the web one floor). The part you can *see* is only a part, and your viewpoint and means of access is limited.

          9. It’s the infrastructure that allows any of it. The browser is the face, and I have given you examples on where the web is used without a browser at all. Where we do agree is that the Web is a subset of the Internet overall.

          10. Oh, yes, there is plenty to agree on. Like Services require infrastructure (pretty much by definition), and the internet is bigger than the web.

            “Still, if an App depends on web services, it still relies on the Web, not just the browser. The Web is bigger than the browser.”

            I do concede that the web is bigger than the browser (in that everything web-related is not immediately observable in the browser, nor occurring in/rendered by the browser).

            However, I feel that you want to call anything that touches the web, a “web service”. Whereas I would say that the fact it is accessible through the web only makes that access a web service; whereas, everything else about it makes it part of something much larger, the internet. And being able to interact with other sides of it, at different levels, in addition to the web side, make dedicated apps potentially far more useful and powerful than a browser. Particularly since Apps can contain a browser (again, the notion that a small part doesn’t define the whole).

          12. Timely quote from Ben Evans: “…the future has always looked like a toy that can’t be used for real work.”

            If you can’t see the future, well, you can’t see it. Life goes on, the future will happen without your consent.

          14. I shouldn’t be surprised that you don’t read Evans. You should. I’m going to assume you can use Google.

          16. Evans is a good analyst with lots of valuable information and insight. You can certainly choose to ignore good analysts, but don’t pretend it’s because you don’t care about markets.

          17. It’s that unfathomable to you? I really don’t.
            There’s good country musicians too. It’s not my genre.

          18. I understand completely that you don’t care about markets. That’s no reason to ignore good information. You’re choosing to be less informed and using a very lame excuse to do so.

            The music analogy is an interesting one. Sometimes I’ll be chatting with a person who claims to really be into music, so I’ll ask if they like country music. The common answer is no. This is a test of course. They’re a poseur, they are simply pretending to be a connoisseur of music. Ask any open-minded musician, there is no genre that they’ll say is “not my genre”. By the way, it’s fine to not like all kinds of music, but don’t also pretend you’re a connoisseur.

          19. I’m not pretending to be a connoisseur, quite the opposite. I’m claiming ignorance due to disinterest. I don’t derive pleasure form it.

            Where I have a modicum of interest is when it impacts me, and that is usually when it impacts tech. I do not buy or sell stocks. The only shares I have in anything are some pieces of “sweat equity” I have from some clients, and even there I almost never check the value.

            PS- Perhaps he has good information, it’s not relevant enough to me. There’s other good information in the world that interests me more.

          20. This explains why you can’t see the future re: tech, you’re not informed or aware enough outside of your immediate bubble.

          22. Your words: “I’m claiming ignorance due to disinterest.” Now, it’s perfectly fine to ignore some knowledge, but you don’t also get to pretend you’re some kind of intellectual when it comes to discussing tech and its impact/future. Not when you ignore entire aspects simply because they don’t interest you. That’s exactly like claiming to love music, but saying you don’t like country music. This is tiring, say whatever you like, I’m out.

          23. My not finding something interesting does not invalidate it. I simply leave it to those that do find it interesting.

            “Prediction is very difficult, especially about the future.” – Niels Bohr, and others
            The only thing we stand a chance at predicting is to look at initial conditions (today) and trends (today) and where they might take us into the very near future.

            Some things are just fundamental truths. What makes them fundamental? They’re resilient towards time. I prefer to comment on the fundamentals, not what the next hot tech is going to be that “defines the future, whou, ha, ha, ha”. More often than not, it’s folly.

            I’ll know the future when I see it. Beforehand it’s too complex to make long term predictions reliably. If I could, then I still wouldn’t be interested in analysts. I would be a billionaire and run for President.

            As far as my being an “intellectual”, well thank you for disputing that I am, because then at least, I’ve been considered. I’m not an intellectual. Never claimed to be. That’s not for me to judge. In fact, I’ve told others in the past that they are not to consider me to be credentialed in computers, in any official sense.

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  206. Сухой корм для собак гипоаллергенный без ГМО бренда Forward на Ozon: идеальное питание для вашего питомца

    С заботой о здоровье и комфорте наших собак становится все важнее давать им качественное и здоровое питание.

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    Один из главных преимуществ сухого корма для собак Forward – это его специальная формула, разработанная для собак, склонных к пищевым аллергиям и пищевой непереносимости.
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    Основные особенности гипоаллергенного
    корма для собак Forward:
    1. Отсутствие ГМО: Бренд Forward уделяет особое внимание качеству своих
    продуктов, поэтому сухой корм для собак Forward не
    содержит ГМО компонентов.
    Это гарантирует, что ваш питомец получит
    только натуральные и безопасные ингредиенты.

    2. Многообразие вкусов и рецептов: Сухой корм для собак
    Forward предлагает различные вкусовые варианты, чтобы угодить самым привередливым питомцам.
    На Ozon вы можете найти различные вкусовые комбинации, включая индейку и ягненка, которые
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    полноценными пищевыми веществами.

    3. Благоприятное воздействие
    на здоровье: Благодаря использованию высококачественных ингредиентов,
    сухой корм для собак Forward помогает поддерживать
    здоровье кожи и шерсти, укрепляет иммунную систему и способствует здоровому развитию суставов и мышц.

    4. Удобная покупка на Ozon: Приобретение
    сухого корма для собак Forward на Ozon становится еще более простым и
    удобным вариантом. Вам не нужно выходить из дома,
    вам достаточно выбрать нужный
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    Благодаря удобному сервису доставки на Ozon, ваш заказ будет доставлен прямо к вашему домашнему
    порогу в кратчайшие сроки.

    Неотъемлемой частью заботы о вашем любимце является его правильное питание.
    Поэтому выбор гипоаллергенного и
    без ГМО корма для собак Forward на Ozon позволит вам обеспечить вашего питомца всеобъемлющим и здоровым питанием, не
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    “Сухой корм для щенков гипоаллергенный без ГМО с мясом индейки и ягненка бренда Forward: забота о здоровье вашего малыша”

    Если вы ищете идеальное питание
    для вашего щенка, то гипоаллергенный сухой
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    мясом индейки и ягненка от бренда Forward – идеальный выбор.
    Forward является одним из наиболее уважаемых
    и надежных производителей корма для собак, и их гипоаллергенный корм для щенков с мясом индейки и ягненка не исключение.

    Гипоаллергенный сухой корм
    для щенков Forward предназначен
    для маленьких питомцев, которые могут быть склонны к аллергическим реакциям и пищевой непереносимости.
    Он разработан с использованием натуральных и безопасных ингредиентов, чтобы обеспечить здоровое питание вашего щенка.

    Основные преимущества гипоаллергенного
    корма для щенков Forward:
    1. Высокое качество: Forward обеспечивает высокое качество своих
    продуктов, используя только
    натуральные ингредиенты без ГМО.
    Это гарантирует, что ваш щенок получит все необходимые питательные вещества для здорового роста и развития.

    2. Мясо индейки и ягненка:
    Гипоаллергенный корм для
    щенков Forward содержит мясо индейки и ягненка,
    которые являются источниками высококачественного белка.
    Белок является важным строительным материалом для роста мышц и
    развития вашего щенка.

    3. Удовлетворение потребностей:
    Корм Forward специально разработан, чтобы соответствовать потребностям растущего щенка.
    Он содержит оптимальное соотношение питательных веществ, чтобы обеспечить правильное развитие скелета, иммунной системы и пищеварения щенка.

    4. Доступность на Wildberries: Сухой корм для щенков Forward
    гипоаллергенный без ГМО с мясом индейки и ягненка
    доступен для покупки на Wildberries.
    Это удобное место для покупки, где вы можете получить качественные
    продукты прямо у вашего дома.

    Выбор качественного корма для вашего щенка
    является основой его здоровья и благополучия.
    Гипоаллергенный сухой корм для щенков Forward
    с мясом индейки и ягненка обеспечит
    вашего малыша всем необходимым для его
    здорового роста и развития без риска развития
    аллергических реакций или пищевой непереносимости.

    “Сухой корм для собак гипоаллергенный индейка и ягненок без ГМО бренда Forward на Wildberries: забота о вашем питомце”

    Бренд Forward известен своими инновационными подходами к разработке здорового и качественного корма для собак.
    И если вы ищете сухой корм для собак гипоаллергенный, содержащий
    индейку и ягненка и не содержащий ГМО, то Forward предлагает отличный
    вариант, доступный для приобретения на Wildberries.

    Сухой корм для собак гипоаллергенный
    Forward с индейкой и ягненком предназначен для
    собак, страдающих от аллергий и пищевой непереносимости.
    Он разработан с использованием натуральных ингредиентов высокого качества, исключающих использование ГМО, чтобы обеспечить здоровое питание вашего питомца.

    Основные преимущества гипоаллергенного
    корма для собак Forward на Wildberries:
    1. Гипоаллергенная формула: Благодаря специальной формуле, гипоаллергенный корм Forward
    помогает предотвратить появление аллергических реакций и пищевой
    непереносимости у вашей собаки, обеспечивая комфортное и здоровое пищеварение.

    2. Натуральные ингредиенты: Корм Forward производится из натуральных ингредиентов высокого качества, которые не содержат ГМО.
    Это гарантирует, что ваш питомец получит только натуральное и безопасное
    питание.

    3. Индейка и ягненок: Сухой корм Forward содержит мясо
    индейки и ягненка, которые являются источниками высококачественного белка и не содержат
    лишних заполнителей. Это помогает поддерживать здоровье
    мышц и обеспечивать необходимую энергию.

    4. Доступность на Wildberries: Корм Forward гипоаллергенный индейка
    и ягненок без ГМО предлагается для покупки
    на Wildberries. Это позволяет вам
    легко приобрести корм и удобно получить его в удобное для вас время и место.

    Забота о здоровье и питании вашей собаки
    – это важная ответственность.
    Выбор сухого корма Forward гипоаллергенного с индейкой и ягненком без ГМО на Wildberries позволит вам обеспечить своего питомца качественным и
    безопасным питанием особого состава, учитывая его индивидуальные потребности и предотвращая развитие аллергических реакций.

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